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Phoebe Halliwell

Men Are Trash: The Megathread

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so that it is not buried in like the pinkerton thread or wherever this got posted

https://consequenceofsound.net/2017/11/a-running-list-of-all-the-dudes-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-since-harvey-weinstein/

Harvey Weinstein, movie producer

Ben Affleck, actor

Roy Price, former chief of Amazon Studios

Bob Weinstein, movie producer

The Gaslamp Killer, musician

— Chris Savino, creator of Nickelodeon’s Loud House

Oliver Stone, director

John Besh, celebrity chef

— Leon Wieseltier, former editor of The Atlantic and The New Republic

Matthew Mondanile, former guitarist of Real Estate

— Lockhart Steele, former editorial director of Vox Media

Lars Von Trier, director

Andy Signore, creator of Honest Trailers

Alex Calder, musician

— Elie Wiesel, Holocaust survivor

Twiggy Ramirez, former bassist Marilyn Manson

Terry Richardson, photographer

George H.W. Bush, 41st president of the United States

Ethan Kath, founding member of Crystal Castles

James Toback, director

Kevin Spacey, actor

Jeremy Piven, actor

David Blaine, magician

Brett Ratner, director

Mark Halperin, political journalist

Dustin Hoffman, actor

Andy Dick, actor

— Michael Oreskes, former head of NPR News

Kirt Webster, publicist

— Rick Najera, director of CBS’s Diversity Showcase

— David Guillod, movie producer

John Singleton, director

Ed Westwick, actor

Charlie Sheen, actor

Robert Knepper, actor

Jeffrey Tambor, actor

Steven Seagal, actor

Louis C.K., comedian

Matthew Weiner, creator of Mad Men

André Balazs, hotelier

Roy Moore, Republican Senate candidate in Alabama

Russell Simmons, hip-hop mogul

Jann Wenner, founder of Rolling Stone

Jesse Lacy, frontman of Brand New

Sepp Blatter, former president of FIFA

— Gary Goddard, theme park designer

Andrew Kreisberg, showrunner of Supergirl and Flash

Richard Dreyfuss, actor

George Takei, actor

Eddie Berganza, editor for DC Comics

…and lest we forget…

Donald Trump, 45th president of the United States *

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for funsies, i would also like to include a list of people who signed a petition to free noted trash man, roman polanski

 

Natalie Portman

Tilda Swinton

Isabelle Huppert

Penelope Cruz

Diane von Furstenberg

Wes Anderson

Darren Aronofsky

Martin Scorsese

Monica Bellucci

Alejandro Gonzalez Inarritu

Harmony Korine

Ethan Cohen

David Lynch

Harrison Ford

Fatih Akin
Stephane Allagnon
Woody Allen
Pedro Almodovar
Jean-Jacques Annaud
Alexandre Arcady
Fanny Ardant
Asia Argento
Olivier Assayas
Alexander Astruc
Gabriel Auer
Luc Barnier
Christophe Barratier
Xavier Beauvois
Liria Begeja
Gilles Behat
Jean-Jacques Beineix
Marco Bellochio
Djamel Bennecib
Giuseppe Bertolucci
Patrick Bouchitey
Paul Boujenah
Jacques Bral
Patrick Braoudé
Andre Buytaers
Christian Carion
Henning Carlsen
Jean-Michel Carre
Patrice Chereau
Elie Chouraqui
Souleymane Cisse
Alain Corneau
Jerome Cornuau
Miguel Courtois
Dominique Crevecoeur
Alfonso Cuaron
Luc et Jean-Pierre Dardenne
Jonathan Demme
Alexandre Desplat
Rosalinde et Michel Deville
Georges Dybman
Jacques Fansten
Joël Farges
Gianluca Farinelli
Jacques Fansten
Etienne Faure
Michel Ferry
Scott Foundas
Stephen Frears
Thierry Fremaux
Sam Gabarski
René Gainville
Tony Gatlif
Costa Gavras
Jean-Marc Ghanassia
Terry Gilliam
Christian Gion
Marc Guidoni
Buck Henry
David Heyman
Laurent Heynemann
Robert Hossein
Jean-Loup Hubert
Gilles Jacob
Just Jaeckin
Alain Jessua
Pierre Jolivet
Kent Jones
Roger Kahane,
Nelly Kaplan
Wong Kar Waï
Ladislas Kijno
Jan Kounen
Diane Kurys
Emir Kusturica
John Landis
Claude Lanzmann
André Larquié
Vinciane Lecocq
Patrice Leconte
Claude Lelouch
Gérard Lenne
Michael Mann
François Margolin
Jean-Pierre Marois
Tonie Marshall
Mario Martone
Nicolas Mauvernay
Radu Mihaileanu
Claude Miller
Mario Monicelli
Jeanne Moreau
Sandra Nicolier
Michel Ocelot
Alexander Payne
Richard Pena
Michele Placido
Philippe Radault
Jean-Paul Rappeneau
Raphael Rebibo
Yasmina Reza
Jacques Richard
Laurence Roulet
Walter Salles
Jean-Paul Salomé
Marc Sandberg
Jerry Schatzberg
Julian Schnabel
Barbet Schroeder
Ettore Scola
Charlotte Silvera
Abderrahmane Sissako
Paolo Sorrentino
Guillaume Stirn
Jean-Charles Tacchella
Radovan Tadic
Danis Tanovic
Bertrand Tavernier
Cécile Telerman
Alain Terzian
Pascal Thomas
Giuseppe Tornatore
Serge Toubiana
Nadine Trintignant
Tom Tykwer
Alexandre Tylski
Betrand Van Effenterre
Wim Wenders

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8 minutes ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

Harvey Weinstein, movie producer

Ben Affleck, actor

Roy Price, former chief of Amazon Studios

Bob Weinstein, movie producer

The Gaslamp Killer, musician

— Chris Savino, creator of Nickelodeon’s Loud House

Oliver Stone, director

John Besh, celebrity chef

— Leon Wieseltier, former editor of The Atlantic and The New Republic

Matthew Mondanile, former guitarist of Real Estate

— Lockhart Steele, former editorial director of Vox Media

Lars Von Trier, director

Andy Signore, creator of Honest Trailers

Alex Calder, musician

— Elie Wiesel, Holocaust survivor

Twiggy Ramirez, former bassist Marilyn Manson

Terry Richardson, photographer

George H.W. Bush, 41st president of the United States

Ethan Kath, founding member of Crystal Castles

James Toback, director

Kevin Spacey, actor

Jeremy Piven, actor

David Blaine, magician

Brett Ratner, director

Mark Halperin, political journalist

Dustin Hoffman, actor

Andy Dick, actor

— Michael Oreskes, former head of NPR News

Kirt Webster, publicist

— Rick Najera, director of CBS’s Diversity Showcase

— David Guillod, movie producer

John Singleton, director

Ed Westwick, actor

Charlie Sheen, actor

Robert Knepper, actor

Jeffrey Tambor, actor

Steven Seagal, actor

Louis C.K., comedian

Matthew Weiner, creator of Mad Men

André Balazs, hotelier

Roy Moore, Republican Senate candidate in Alabama

Russell Simmons, hip-hop mogul

Jann Wenner, founder of Rolling Stone

Jesse Lacy, frontman of Brand New

Sepp Blatter, former president of FIFA

— Gary Goddard, theme park designer

Andrew Kreisberg, showrunner of Supergirl and Flash

Richard Dreyfuss, actor

George Takei, actor

Eddie Berganza, editor for DC Comics

…and lest we forget…

Donald Trump, 45th president of the United States *

 

The Brit Crew roster 

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4 minutes ago, Scorps said:

Since Trump was elected I have become so sceptical of pretty much everyone I interact with (justifiably so in many cases where I've truly reevaluated the way they act) that I have basically stopped hanging out with most people aside from my gf and it feels really bad. Having to accept that most men have awful opinions and do awful things is something that I continually struggle to reconcile with actually functioning as a person, and somewhere in my bed there needs to be an arbitrary line that lets me think people are okay but I don't know where to draw it.

 

I can't imagine what it's like to have been assaulted and I hope that actual societal change occurs.

as somebody who has clearly been aware of trash men forever and who has rarely shut up about it, i'm in a similar position as you. in a sense you know what the fuck is going on, but convince yourself not to really grapple with it or confront it in your mind. and feeling the way i do now that all the shit i pushed down is catching up with me, i remember why it was so important to push it down in the first place. beyond the people who have actually harassed or assaulted somebody, there are very few men in my life i haven't felt let down by recently. it makes trust seem impossible.

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I mean when is that polanski list from? I forget when but I remember reading some post on tumblr a while ago about how the whole art/artist separation argument is p much a relic of a time when 1) information didn't spread nearly as quickly and wasn't so easily retrievable as it is now and 2) there were way more gatekeepers in place determining what media was available to the broader public, and that really stuck with me. I mean there are still plenty of people who cling to that argument but I feel like there's been a cultural shift away from it for sure. like for anyone that gives even half a shit about who they're supporting (not just economically, engaging with media on any level is arguably a form of support but that is a whole nother argument) there is currently an infinitely deep and constantly growing stream of readily accessible music art etc, much of it being created by people from groups that are historically underrepresented. even though there are plenty of shitheads getting scared they won't be able to enjoy their favorite albums anymore it literally has never been easier to seek out entertainment NOT made by shitty people. maybe more so with music than movies and stuff since those are all a complex web of producers and financiers and whatever but like...I don't know. I'm not totally sure where I'm going with this and I'm not saying I would necessarily expect better of a bunch of A-listers who live in a totally different reality than us but if the last few weeks are any indication if a petition like that were to make the rounds today I'd hope that....it wouldn't

 

now watch it be from like last week

 

edit: nvm just googled it, 2009. I guess that's longer ago than it really feels like and most of the changes I'm talking about have happened more in the 2010s but it's still indefensible 

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1 minute ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

as somebody who has clearly been aware of trash men forever and who has rarely shut up about it, i'm in a similar position as you. in a sense you know what the fuck is going on, but convince yourself not to really grapple with it or confront it in your mind. and feeling the way i do now that all the shit i pushed down is catching up with me, i remember why it was so important to push it down in the first place. beyond the people who have actually harassed or assaulted somebody, there are very few men in my life i haven't felt let down by recently. it makes trust seem impossible.

 

I really don't know how to fix that without throwing out your morals/self worth/dignity etc. I can try my best to tune out dumb opinions and parts of a conversation I don't like, but I'm not a woman so at least I'm not the subject of their words or actions.

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2 minutes ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

there are very few men in my life i haven't felt let down by recently. it makes trust seem impossible.

i feel the same way

 

at this point i'm almost paranoid that one of my male friends will blurt out something inconceivably awful about recent events and i will be left heartbroken and unable to speak to them ever again

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9 minutes ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

as somebody who has clearly been aware of trash men forever and who has rarely shut up about it, i'm in a similar position as you. in a sense you know what the fuck is going on, but convince yourself not to really grapple with it or confront it in your mind. and feeling the way i do now that all the shit i pushed down is catching up with me, i remember why it was so important to push it down in the first place. beyond the people who have actually harassed or assaulted somebody, there are very few men in my life i haven't felt let down by recently. it makes trust seem impossible.

 

Just now, psycho said:

i feel the same way

 

at this point i'm almost paranoid that one of my male friends will blurt out something inconceivably awful about recent events and i will be left heartbroken and unable to speak to them ever again

this sucks, i'm sorry. 

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1 minute ago, >:| said:

I mean when is that polanski list from? I forget when but I remember reading some post on tumblr a while ago about how the whole art/artist separation argument is p much a relic of a time when 1) information didn't spread nearly as quickly and wasn't so easily retrievable as it is now and 2) there were way more gatekeepers in place determining what media was available to the broader public, and that really stuck with me. I mean there are still plenty of people who cling to that argument but I feel like there's been a cultural shift away from it for sure. like for anyone that gives even half a shit about who they're supporting (not just economically, engaging with media on any level is arguably a form of support but that is a whole nother argument) there is currently an infinitely deep and constantly growing stream of readily accessible music art etc, much of it being created by people from groups that are historically underrepresented. even though there are plenty of shitheads getting scared they won't be able to enjoy their favorite albums anymore it literally has never been easier to seek out entertainment NOT made by shitty people. maybe more so with music than movies and stuff since those are all a complex web of producers and financiers and whatever but like...I don't know. I'm not totally sure where I'm going with this and I'm not saying I would necessarily expect better of a bunch of A-listers who live in a totally different reality than us but if the last few weeks are any indication if a petition like that were to make the rounds today I'd hope that....it wouldn't

 

now watch it be from like last week

this happened in 2009. he was detained when traveled to switzerland for a film festival. the full text of the infuriating and mind boggling petition:



Petition for Roman Polanski

We have learned the astonishing news of Roman Polanski’s arrest by the Swiss police on September 26th, upon arrival in Zurich (Switzerland) while on his way to a film festival where he was due to receive an award for his career in filmmaking.

His arrest follows an American arrest warrant dating from 1978 against the filmmaker, in a case of morals.

Filmmakers in France, in Europe, in the United States and around the world are dismayed by this decision. It seems inadmissible to them that an international cultural event, paying homage to one of the greatest contemporary filmmakers, is used by the police to apprehend him.

By their extraterritorial nature, film festivals the world over have always permitted works to be shown and for filmmakers to present them freely and safely, even when certain States opposed this.

The arrest of Roman Polanski in a neutral country, where he assumed he could travel without hindrance, undermines this tradition: it opens the way for actions of which no one can know the effects.

Roman Polanski is a French citizen, a renown and international artist now facing extradition. This extradition, if it takes place, will be heavy in consequences and will take away his freedom.

Filmmakers, actors, producers and technicians — everyone involved in international filmmaking — want him to know that he has their support and friendship.

On September 16th, 2009, Mr. Charles Rivkin, the US Ambassador to France, received French artists and intellectuals at the embassy. He presented to them the new Minister Counselor for Public Affairs at the embassy, Ms Judith Baroody. In perfect French she lauded the Franco-American friendship and recommended the development of cultural relations between our two countries.

If only in the name of this friendship between our two countries, we demand the immediate release of Roman Polanski.

 

the rest of your post is very nice and all but in this post-weinstein world, more victims of roman polanski have come out and nobody seems to give a flying fuck. woody allen, another relic of a time when people ostensibly gave less of a shit about rape and pedophilia, still has an oscar baity film coming out that does not appear to be in trouble of being pulled by its distributor. even us woke internet types were having arguments not even a year ago about whether or not it was acceptable to see mumbling by the sea and birth of a nation. so i'm gonna call bullshit on that one.

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30 minutes ago, Scorps said:

Since Trump was elected I have become so sceptical of pretty much everyone I interact with (justifiably so in many cases where I've truly reevaluated the way they act) that I have basically stopped hanging out with most people aside from my gf and it feels really bad. Having to accept that most men have awful opinions and do awful things is something that I continually struggle to reconcile with actually functioning as a person, and somewhere in my bed there needs to be an arbitrary line that lets me think people are okay but I don't know where to draw it.

 

I can't imagine what it's like to have been assaulted and I hope that actual societal change occurs.

 

I'm going to add to this with a problem that has a pretty easy solution.

I have childhood friends who I have known since i was a 6 or so. I've been distancing myself from them because they have some shitty views on women/politics. But lately i think it'll come to a head on having to straight up confront them, half because I want to see if its even worth it to open the dialogue and if not, it'll be easier to punt them.

Recently, I've gotten more confrontational in general and I was very much a passive aggressive person in the past, but spending years in quiet anger only gets you so far, and I sometimes feel like shit for keeping quiet and everything on the status quo for so long. I patted myself on the back too long for accepting that I dont think this way, so I'm good. 

It's weird to think about pushing out decades long presences in my life, but the urge to reconcile these feelings has overwhelmed tiptoeing around them

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Just now, wahdiohead said:

 

I'm going to add to this with a problem that has a pretty easy solution.

I have childhood friends who I have known since i was a 6 or so. I've been distancing myself from them because they have some shitty views on women/politics. But lately i think it'll come to a head on having to straight up confront them, half because I want to see if its even worth it to open the dialogue and if not, it'll be easier to punt them.

Recently, I've gotten more confrontational in general and I was very much a passive aggressive person in the past, but spending years in quiet anger only gets you so far, and I sometimes feel like shit for keeping quiet and everything on the status quo for so long. I patted myself on the back too long for accepting that I dont think this way, so I'm good. 

It's weird to think about pushing out decade long presences in my life, but the urge to reconcile these feelings has overwhelmed tiptoeing around them

i am going through the same thing, specifically with one friend. i've gotten into arguments with him before and confronted him about shit as well and it was futile. he's forever going to be the way he is. 

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2 minutes ago, wahdiohead said:

 

I'm going to add to this with a problem that has a pretty easy solution.

I have childhood friends who I have known since i was a 6 or so. I've been distancing myself from them because they have some shitty views on women/politics. But lately i think it'll come to a head on having to straight up confront them, half because I want to see if its even worth it to open the dialogue and if not, it'll be easier to punt them.

Recently, I've gotten more confrontational in general and I was very much a passive aggressive person in the past, but spending years in quiet anger only gets you so far, and I sometimes feel like shit for keeping quiet and everything on the status quo for so long. I patted myself on the back too long for accepting that I dont think this way, so I'm good. 

It's weird to think about pushing out decade long presences in my life, but the urge to reconcile these feelings has overwhelmed tiptoeing around them

for what it's worth, i have noticed you doing this here and on FB and you are one of very few people who seems willing to do it. i'm not giving you a cookie for it but these actions are seen and appreciated. there is nothing worse than being out on a limb in the first place and having everyone else just kinda stare at you awkwardly.

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speaking of woody allen, here's a list of actors who have worked with him since dylan farrow published a letter in 2014 saying that he molested her when she was a child:

Parker Posey x2
Emma Stone x2
Colin Firth
Kate Winslet
Justin Timberlake
Juno Temple
Jim Belushi
Jude Law
Diego Luna
Liev Schreiber
Joaquin Phoenix
Jesse Eisenberg
Kristen Stewart
Steve Carell
Blake Lively
Timothée Chalamet
Selena Gomez
Elle Fanning
Sheryl Lee :Laura:
Marcia Gay Harden
Rebecca Hall
Suki Waterhouse
Jacki Weaver
David Krumholtz
Anna Camp
Paul Schneider
Corey Stoll
Jack Gore
Debi Mazar
Tony Sirico
Steve Schirripa
Max Casella
Hamish Linklater
Simon McBurney
Jeannie Berlin
Ken Stott
Eileen Atkins
Tony Sirico
Stephen Kunken
Sari Lennick
Max Adler
Don Stark
Gregg Binkley
Jamie Blackley
Betsey Aidem
Ethan Phillips
Sophie von Haselberg
Ben Rosenfield
Susan Pourfar

 

i would have posted a list of everybody who worked with him since it became public knowledge that he married soon-yi, but that would just be too long of a list.

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here are some of the reasons actors have given for working with woody allen. you won't hear anybody from his recent film speaking on this, as they've canceled red carpet events and press tours to avoid being asked the question.

 

Kristen Stewart: The Cafe Society actress briefly touched on the decision to work with Allen at a Cannes press event this week with co-star Eisenberg, saying that the abuse allegations are only allegations, and that she doesn't want to judge an artist for what other people say about him. "We don't know any of these people involved," she told Variety...“I was like, ‘What do you think? We don’t know any of these people involved. I can personalize situations, which would be very wrong.’ At the end of the day, Jesse [Eisenberg] and I talked about this. If we were persecuted for the amount of shit that’s been said about us that’s not true, our lives would be over. The experience of making the movie was so outside of that, it was fruitful for the two of us to go on with it.”

Diane Keaton: After Dylan Farrow called out Allen's stars in 2014, including Annie Hall's Keaton, in The New York Times ("You knew me when I was a little girl, Diane Keaton. Have you forgotten me?"), Keaton responded in an interview with The Guardian, saying simply, "I believe my friend."

Wallace Shawn: The Manhattan actor wrote a piece for the Los Angeles Times in February 2014 defending Allen: "I personally would have to say that it would take overwhelming evidence to convince me that he had sexually abused a child, just as it would take overwhelming evidence to convince me that Desmond Tutu, Franklin D. Roosevelt or Doris Lessing had sexually abused a child." He concluded: "Obviously if he did not in fact commit the crime, this is an appalling situation."

Scarlett Johansson: The Match Point star, who was also included in the list of actresses mentioned by Farrow in The New York Times article, distanced herself from Allen's past, telling The Guardian in March 2014 that "It's not like this is somebody that's been prosecuted and found guilty of something, and you can then go, 'I don't support this lifestyle or whatever.' I mean, it's all guesswork." She added, "It would be ridiculous for me to make any kind of assumption one way or the other." “I think it’s irresponsible to take a bunch of actors that will have a Google alert on and to suddenly throw their name into a situation that none of us could possibly knowingly comment on,” Johansson said. “That just feels irresponsible to me.”

Cate Blanchett: Promoting Blue Jasmine at the Santa Barbara Film Festival in 2014, Blanchett didn't want to address the accusations against Allen, saying that it's a family ordeal. "It's obviously been a long and painful situation for the family," said Blanchett, "and I hope they find some sort of resolution and peace."

Alec Baldwin: In the midst of promoting Blue Jasmine with co-star Blanchett, Baldwin tweeted a series of comments that distanced himself as an actor from what he saw as a family conflict. "What the f&@% is wrong w u that u think we all need to b commenting on this family's personal struggle?" he wrote. "So you know who's guilty? Who's lying? You, personally, know that?" he continued, adding: "You are mistaken if you think there is a place for me, or any outsider, in this family's issue."

Kate Winslet  (who also explained that she decided to work with Woody Allen because it's what her dying mother would have wanted her to do):

Did the allegations against Woody Allen give you pause?

Of course one thinks about it. But at the same time, I didn’t know Woody and I don’t know anything about that family. As the actor in the film, you just have to step away and say, I don’t know anything, really, and whether any of it is true or false. Having thought it all through, you put it to one side and just work with the person. Woody Allen is an incredible director. So is Roman Polanski. I had an extraordinary working experience with both of those men, and that’s the truth.

Blake Lively:

“It’s amazing what Woody has written for women,” said Blake Lively … noting a series of complicated female characters dating back to the 1970s.

Lively said any news coverage of Allen’s personal life did not register as she was making the movie.

“It’s very dangerous to factor in things you don’t know anything about,” she said. “I could [only] know my experience. And my experience with Woody is he’s empowering to women.”

 

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In the interest of honesty, I feel very disappointed in men but I don't hate my husband so when people say they hate all men it makes me feel uncomfortable like I'm not doing feminism right but I do  understand the emotion and feel similarly about all but maybe a handful of men (being my husband, my friends husband's and a few guys here). I don't really have male friends and I about discussing these things at work bc I am afraid of being the angry feminist. Around friends and family I will speak out but that's kinda preaching to the choir.

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13 minutes ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

the rest of your post is very nice and all but in this post-weinstein world, more victims of roman polanski have come out and nobody seems to give a flying fuck. woody allen, another relic of a time when people ostensibly gave less of a shit about rape and pedophilia, still has an oscar baity film coming out that does not appear to be in trouble of being pulled by its distributor. even us woke internet types were having arguments not even a year ago about whether or not it was acceptable to see mumbling by the sea and birth of a nation. so i'm gonna call bullshit on that one.

well yeah, I don't mean to insinuate that it's anything more than a growing minority adopting that kind of attitude but I do think it is growing. and I don't think that just waiting for old ways of thinking to die has ever served any cause well because like you said there are plenty of people in our generation who are still lionizing these monsters and don't see any reason for things to change, and for most people it's always going to be easier to uphold the canon than to do any real meaningful self-questioning about the media we consume and the power imbalances that that consumption reifies. idk what sort of argument I'm trying to make here if any. I certainly hope that things are changing

 

11 minutes ago, wahdiohead said:

 

I'm going to add to this with a problem that has a pretty easy solution.

I have childhood friends who I have known since i was a 6 or so. I've been distancing myself from them because they have some shitty views on women/politics. But lately i think it'll come to a head on having to straight up confront them, half because I want to see if its even worth it to open the dialogue and if not, it'll be easier to punt them.

Recently, I've gotten more confrontational in general and I was very much a passive aggressive person in the past, but spending years in quiet anger only gets you so far, and I sometimes feel like shit for keeping quiet and everything on the status quo for so long. I patted myself on the back too long for accepting that I dont think this way, so I'm good. 

It's weird to think about pushing out decades long presences in my life, but the urge to reconcile these feelings has overwhelmed tiptoeing around them

 

yeah this is also kind of how I feel. I've always been very conflict-avoidant irl but the truth of the matter is I barely socialize or go out and hardly anybody knows I exist anyway so what's the fucking point of sitting at home reading articles all day just to reassure myself that I'm not one of the bad ones

 

I have a v hard time asserting myself in online spaces and I've been working on that but I've been trying to speak up more when these things come up in person and have had some good conversations with other guy friends that I was unsure about, in some cases discovering that they weren't really guys I wanted to associate with anymore but in other cases actually getting somewhere productive, hopefully. I mean there's a time to shut up and listen and there's a time to step in and set people straight and I think generally it's far too easy for a dude who generally "gets it" to lean heavily on the former while allowing himself to think that he's still doing the right thing, and I've certainly done that plenty too

 

tbh one of my biggest regrets from when I worked as a camp counselor is that I wasn't more proactive about discussing social issues with the kids. I had 16 year olds for 2 years, which is a crucial fucking time when so much warped shit about gender and sexuality gets pumped into their brains constantly but because it was so difficult to be assertive about that when you're one guy in front of a group of 20 horny teenagers who think they know everything I mostly avoided it except for when I was talking one-on-one to the kids who seemed more receptive to it in the first place. but I could have done more to at least introduce those ideas to the rest of them and it really weighs pretty heavily on me that I took the easy way out on that one 

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4 minutes ago, zuval said:

In the interest of honesty, I feel very disappointed in men but I don't hate my husband so when people say they hate all men it makes me feel uncomfortable like I'm not doing feminism right but I do  understand the emotion and feel similarly about all but maybe a handful of men (being my husband, my friends husband's and a few guys here). I don't really have male friends and I about discussing these things at work bc I am afraid of being the angry feminist. Around friends and family I will speak out but that's kinda preaching to the choir.

i would never say that i genuinely hate all men but on a gut level i have a general distrust of men and those are just the facts no matter how much i've tried to talk myself out of it. it used to make me crazy in activist circles especially when white women would dogpile on "all men" when it's often black and brown men on the front lines of these causes and who are more at risk in many ways. but since most of the discourse in activist circles seems to be really dude-heavy anyway that's not #1 on my list of things to worry about right now.

sugarface, alan, ocean and 1 other like this

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16 minutes ago, Evil Paige Matthews said:

i would never say that i genuinely hate all men but on a gut level i have a general distrust of men and those are just the facts no matter how much i've tried to talk myself out of it. it used to make me crazy in activist circles especially when white women would dogpile on "all men" when it's often black and brown men on the front lines of these causes and who are more at risk in many ways. but since most of the discourse in activist circles seems to be really dude-heavy anyway that's not #1 on my list of things to worry about right now.

 

I totally get that. Generally I am distrustful of men outside of that small circle, I feel like it's only a matter of time until someone says something super disappointing.

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